<|jemc|>
for what it's worth, a more concurrent load shows rubinius beating MRI by about 20%
<|jemc|>
although with that benchmark I wasn't about to run with FFI = Rubinius::FFI because of more 'invalid pointer' issues
<|jemc|>
I think maybe Rubinius::FFI is having some kind of issue trying to free the pointer twice - I'll have to investigate it more
<|jemc|>
and this is all still a moot point until rubinius runs on ARM :)
<diegoviola>
" Ruby is just not attracting the attention and crowdfare it used to. Engine Yard used to be Ruby only (and supported JRuby and Rubinus ...) and has since added more languages as Ruby is not the beginning nor the end. That isn't saying Ruby is dying; just there is competition and sometimes it's hard to compete."
<diegoviola>
what do you say to that?
<slaught>
diegoviola: adapt or die
<slaught>
or the more nuanced ecology-esque answer. construct a niche or die.
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<[spoiler]>
"That isn't saying Ruby is dying; just there is competition and sometimes it's hard to compete" not sure if that refers to their business strategy (diversity means more money, in the end) or if it means that Ruby is not very good at competing lol
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<bennyklotz>
and if he needs more details he should talk to you :)
<brixen>
I sent him several tweets calling out specific points, like statsd
<brixen>
we'll have to see if he responds
<bennyklotz>
okay cool
<bennyklotz>
*hope*
<diegoviola>
I'm still confused with rubinius-x, will rubinius always remain compatible with MRI's version of Ruby?
<brixen>
bennyklotz: if you wanted to spend some time on this, you could round up a list of sites we should be sending "press releases" to :)
<brixen>
diegoviola: the goal of Rubinius is to help people solve hard problems without switching to a non-Ruby language
<brixen>
part of that is making it trivial for people to migrate from a current MRI version to Rubinius
<brixen>
it is that feature that drives MRI compatibility
<bennyklotz>
brixen: I'm not a marketing guy but could do some searching for proper sites :)
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<brixen>
if 90% of people don't care about switching from MRI, we have 1/10 a focus on MRI compatibility
<brixen>
in other words, we need to build the features people actually need to solve their actual problems
<brixen>
the main problem for Rubinius is that we haven't made this the message for the past 7+ years
<brixen>
to the detriment of Rubinius and all those who have left Ruby because MRI isn't useful enough to them
<brixen>
diegoviola: does this answer your Q?
<diegoviola>
brixen: yes, thanks
<brixen>
bennyklotz: you don't have to do the marketing, but helping us build that list would be awesome :)
<bennyklotz>
brixen: okay sure :)
<brixen>
bennyklotz: sweet, thanks
<diegoviola>
brixen: you mention people switching away from Ruby to other languages, that's for sure, but don't you think part of that is just marketing and psychology? we do have things like JRuby and Celluloid
<diegoviola>
brixen: I'm not saying those two things are everything for performance, and I'm not a Java guy myself
<brixen>
diegoviola: I'm not sure what you're asking
<brixen>
are you saying Twitter switching to Scala and not JRuby was just marketing and psychology?
<brixen>
psychology doesn't make your app not throw fail whales
<diegoviola>
no, I mean I'm talking about fads
<brixen>
well, it's on vogue these days to blame Ruby's faults on people only being motivated by hype
<brixen>
there's this field call economics that looks at people's behavior :)
<brixen>
s/on/in/
<brixen>
Rails would not be where it is today if people had not derived significant value at a point in time
<brixen>
people do not pay people to write applications for hype
<diegoviola>
brixen: I'm not claiming that we can improve performance with Ruby by making Rubinius better, I'm saying that part of the reason I see people moving away to other languages might be hype
<diegoviola>
I see nothing wrong with that personally, it's why I moved to Ruby from PHP back in 2008 or so
<brixen>
diegoviola: yes, I hear a lot about hype being the reason and zero actual evidence that people pulling $ out of their wallets being influence primarily by hype
<brixen>
diegoviola: pretty sure moving from PHP to Ruby isn't hype
<diegoviola>
s/can/can't/
<brixen>
and also pretty sure Twitter moving from Ruby to Scala wasn't hype
<brixen>
etc etc
<diegoviola>
well, I didn't just moved just for hype, Ruby was clearly a nicer language and I was looking to learn a general purpose language at that time
<brixen>
diegoviola: I'm not saying hype does not exist, but you don't build a business mostly or even a lot on hype
<diegoviola>
brixen: don't get me wrong, I like rbx and I'm sure if it gives people what they want lots of folks will switch back
<brixen>
people are not that stupid when it comes to their money
<diegoviola>
brixen: I'm talking about individuals and folks who post on Hacker News
<brixen>
there are certainly people who exaggerate some point about a language
<brixen>
diegoviola: I don't use HN
<brixen>
:)
* brixen
lunches
<diegoviola>
ok
<diegoviola>
I'm not sure what business are using now, maybe Java?
<diegoviola>
I've been doing rails development since 2008 or so, freelance work
<diegoviola>
lately I have had a hard time finding work with just Rails
<diegoviola>
it's like you need to know a lot of other things as well these days, JS, angular, ember
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<mustmodify>
Ruby geniuses... I patched Numeric so that I could set a "scale" attribute. I patched Numeric#to_s to respect that scale attribute, so I could see 20.to_s => '20' and other times 20.tap{|n| n.scale = 3}.to_s == 20.000. But now numbers are frozen. Should I create a wrapper class? Seems like a mess just for some formatting. Should I add view helpers and try to remember to use that everywhere in my app? Ouch.
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<mustmodify>
This may see OT, but I'm trying to get my app compatible with RBX so I can use that when I transition to a new server.
<jc00ke>
mustmodify: yeah, seems like a mess for just some formatting ;) I'd go with a wrapper
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<yorickpeterse>
Hm interesting, v2 of the aws-sdk uses multi-xml
<yorickpeterse>
that means it should be easier to hook it into Oga at some point
<yorickpeterse>
that would probably be less effort than fixing v1 of the sdk
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<brixen>
mustmodify: do you have an example of code that is behaving differently on rbx than MRI?
<brixen>
yorickpeterse: that's good news about multi-xml
<brixen>
yorickpeterse: next stop, fix Rails and Rails dependent gems to do so as well :)
<mustmodify>
brixen: no, sorry to be unclear. I'm switching it to be compatible with Ruby 2, since Rubinius no longer offers 1.8 compatibility.
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<yorickpeterse>
brixen: when exactly do we turn something into a vcall?
<|jemc-bot|>
yorickpeterse: it's a true/false flag passed to the bytecode instruction for send